Is USA now going to support terrorist networks based in Pakistan?
68News&Views Feb 2010
Feb 11 2010
Is USA now going to support terrorist networks against India and Afghanistan?
I read an article (see link below) yesterday in NY Times by Jane Perlez, chief correspondent of NY times in Pakistan. It says "American officials said Washington was still debating
the contours of
any negotiated solution. But a baseline for Pakistan, they said, would
be for it to engineer a separation between the Haqqani network and the
Qaeda leadership." The article implies that in return for this
Americans may allow Pakistan to play a central role in resolving
Afghan war. The article also says that "From their stronghold in
Pakistan’s tribal area of North Waziristan,
the Haqqanis exert sway over large parts of southern Afghanistan and
have staged major terrorist attacks in Kabul, American officials
say.They are close allies of Al Qaeda.
But they also have long ties to Pakistan’s military and intelligence
agencies that have protected them inside Pakistani territory." (see link to an Interesting hub by Perrya for some more details about Haqqaini)
All this so that American Army and Government can save their face! I wrote the following comment below the article. I am modifying comment a little to make it more suitable for hub.
My comment
Americans may support terrorist networks whom they were fighting-can it be true
The news article is from people who write from Pakistan. Authenticity of information in such articles is often questionable. If you are in Pakistan and not careful you are often forced to talk their views and not reality. Is this really correct news? If true does this not imply that now USA is going to support terrorist networks of \"Jalaluddin and Siraj Haqqani, whose forces American commanders say are the most lethal battling American and NATO soldiers in Afghanistan.\"
does it save the face ?
All this for face saving? What kind of face saving is this ? What are chances that American top bosses in government and army are so foolish. I hope not!
Americans and their allies from Western Europe are bent on fighting war in af-pak sector from both sides
Though if you see reality, you also wonder what Americans are up to? Right now they seem to be fighting from both sides in af-pak region war. As this article also shows Al-Qaeda, Taleban etc. are basically foot soldiers of machinery created and supported by Pak army, ISI rulers as well as some other feudal lords, mostly in Pakistan, Saudi Arabia etc. (see Spread of Terrorism and USA bent on fighting both sides in af-pak sector war )
Now American army is in Afghanistan to fight these foot soldiers and at the same time Americans are financing and arming armies and these top army bosses and feudal lords in these countries.
Some days back there was a news item that they are going to sell Drones
to Pak army. There is news practically every day about how many
billions they are donating to Pakistan. Pakistani news papers often have
articles showing most of it goes in the pockets of army rulers and
feudal lords. Properties owned by these top bosses does show that this
impression may not be far away from truth.
There are often statements from top army bosses and leaders from USA,
who visit Pakistan that Americans should help Pakistan keep its
strategic assets against India and Afghanistan. There is very little
doubt what Pakistani bosses mean by their assets. They are exactly
these terrorist organizations who train, support and finance attacks
killing quite often people in India or Pakistan (parliament bombings,
26/11, Kashmir killings in India, hotels in Pakistan ) and some times
also in USA, UK, Europe (9/11, London, Spain trains).
Thus Americans are fighting war from both sides. Does this kind of
perpetual war fighting need any face saving? What face remains when you
fight from both sides?
Comments by many Americans below the article say "let us get out -let us get out from there"
No wonder many American comments here are shouting let us get out let us get out. I wonder how many of them really see that Americans are fighting from both sides? Get out from where, and which side?
How many Indians, who write comments here (in NY Times) see that with Americans
fighting from both sides, there is very little scope left for them to
fulfill their wish that Americans should help in stopping terror
machinery used against India being protected from Pakistan. Right now
their goals and interests are some where else and they may remain like
that for some time.
What should India do?
Indians should fight their battles to stop this protection and creation of terrorist machinery in Pakistan. That does not of course necessarily mean Indians should also start fighting or bombing foot soldiers like Americans are doing in these countries.
It can replicate in Pakistan what it has done in Afghanistan. Most
survey in Afghanistan reveal that more than 70% people have good will
towards India while less than 20% towards Pakistan. This is mainly
because India has invested 1.2 billion in building roads and
infra-structure, while Pakistan has spent on building so called its
strategic assets ( terrorist infra-structure). Proposed talks between
India and Pakistan should be more on these aspects (on how to help each other for building up basic infra structure in both countries and economy).
But one has to be
careful also that unlike Afghanistan, interests of army bosses feudal
lords who practically rule Pakistan is against such developments. They
do not want to decrease their hold on masses in Pakistan and use slogans
like Kashmir or "they being protectors of Muslims in India" etc. for this purpose.
Also Indians have to first make themselves strong enough economically
and manage their own set up better to create a minimal life style for every
one in their own country. They should then replicate this in other
countries in the neighborhood of India who are more receptive like
Bhutan, Nepal, Bangladesh, Sri Lanka then try Pakistan. It is not very
hard, India and also its neighbors have enough resources and strength to achieve this in a few
years less than a decade. India needs to first put its own house in order.
What should Americans do
Americans are now in a sort of quagmire situation in three sectors all of which are interlinked.
1. In Pakistan-Afghanistan they are forced to fight war from both sides
2. Americans helped China to get into WTO. According to WTO
agreements a country
has to provide essentially similar subsidies for manufacturing trading
etc. falling under WTO, to its own organizations or foreign
organizations. China has kept its foreign exchange rate practically
constant against US dollar for years, while its currency should
surely have much better rate according to any reasonable
calculations. It should perhaps be at least 40% more. Thus essentially
China is subsidizing its own manufacturers to the extent of 40%. But
Americans are unable to (or not willing to ) come to reasonable
agreements with China or WTO about it. As a result they
seem to be lost in their own quagmires with China. Their own
wealth is getting reduced because they have replaced a lot of their own
manufacturing and servicing by just financial games. Then they see no
options but not to talk directly about it with China but hyphenate it with
India or others. (see News&Views Feb 2010 Economics/Politics USA- China).
Not only this, it seems China is using money so earned to buy influence in Muslim
world (in Pakistan, Iran Saudi Arabia etc. ) basically to bully American
influence and make sure supply for its own oil demand. But with China I also often
feel that this may be just a game being played by top ruling class in China.
Average population in China may have quite different attitude.
3. Oil prices are sky rocketing. There are several articles in NY times
and media and press in USA which suggest that quite a bit of it must be
because of games played by top American oil companies. A large part of
money earned by oil producing countries is going into creating terror
machinery. It is well known in India and Pakistan that a large
conversion of Muslims from milder form Barelvi style to more
conservative Wahebi style is because of finances available to Madrsahs
from Saudi Arabia. (See link below of an exceptionally good analysis by a Pakistani writer on such a change
in Pakistan )
How can a country like USA fall into such quagmires. Corruption at
upper level must be one of the main reasons. Americans should start
thinking about reducing corruption in their own country and efforts to
create corruption and bribing in other countries. But right now they
seem to bent on unleashing a big corruption wave in Pakistan and
Afghanistan in the name of bribing Taleban. Call from Americans should not be just for getting out from af-pak
sector war. It should be to get out of all these 3 quagmires. Let us hope
it happens soon.
Link to articles Article from NY times
Pakistan is said to pursue role in US -Afghan talks
Article from Pakistani newspaper Dawn
The scholar, the sufi, and the fanatic
Hub by Perrya-Disaster in Afghanistan Caused By Bad US Policy
my earlier articles on these topics
Spread of Terrorism and USA bent on fighting both sides in af-pak sector war
News&Views Feb 2010 Economics/Politics USA- China
News&Views Feb 2010
CommentsLoading...
Thanks a lot Roychoudhuri. I do not agree with your view about USA having no alternative. I do not see any reason why USA has to support in a corrupt manner top army bosses and feudal rulers in Pakistan. Just now it is pouring each and every thing including billions of dollars and arms in Pakistan. Most of this money goes into pockets of such corrupt rulers. People in India should be prepared that very soon these arms will be used against them and USA will show only its helplessness about it. Pakistanis are now assessing amount of money given in contracts, during Musharaff's rule, to his relatives and friends. It seems to run in billions.
I hope some time in USA also authorities or journalists in USA investigate how much of this money comes back to USA in irregular deals. It is this type of corruption and support to top army bosses and feudal rulers in Pakistan which is making them loose their war or forcing them to continue it in a fluid state and not their fight in Afghanistan.
Sou,
Hi, long time. I can only tell you what I believe you should think of Obama, do NOT trust him! Many here will back anything he says, but he speaks out of both sides of his mouth.
Our country is suffering, and all he wants to do is blame the previous administration. After a year and a half, what he's done to our deficit, how he wants to make us a socialist country and much more says he wants to destroy the America we have always been.
I enjoyed reading your Hub.
Hi! Harvey
Pleased to hear from you.
I quite agree with u. So far only down-slide is visible in all aspects, economy, relationship with friends of USA, prestige of USA or af-pak war etc.
Interesting hub.
Thanks a lot SweetMocha.
I apologize that - I skipped after reading a bit. The reason is I have studied "America". I am an American. I was in the Marines in Vietnam.
I study the world and America -and- it hurts me when I see "business" overrule the Golden Rule.
America has backed bad businesses for many many decades. There have been elected leaders of countries assassinated by our CIA.
So I've studied. I wish America and Americans would really live up and stand up as we should to those who are causing suffering and hatred.
The GOLDEN RULE is the LAW. Without THIS LAW civilization is uncivilized. Thanks for a great hub.
And yes --"Harvey" says "he wants to destroy the America we have always been."
"Harvey" - there has never been an America as you want to convince people there was. America is on maps and in your head. Sorry- but that's the real truth. I'm very sorry that you and other republicans want to "create" your own history. My goodness - you can't remember the last administration. Democrats? Both parties are an anchor around our country's NECK!
Great hub Soumyasrajan!
Great hub,Soumyasrajan.I completely agree with you.we should not look at any country for any help,specially America.In past they never were faithful.we must concentrate on our own defense and attack mechanism.
Hi! Micky Dee
Thanks for visit. I always like your comments. Your experience and expressions generated by it are visible in them.
I agree with you. It may not comfort you much but just to tell you I have lived both in India and USA. For me USA is like second home. I think politicians in India are much worse.
Over all India is also a country full of resources. But for more than a half century they just went on talking about socialism etc. and wasted a lot of resources.
But it is the people who make up the country and I am very positive about people in both these countries. despite financial problems I still have faith in americans because of their drive (when you have time, see my article
http://hubpages.com/hub/Financial-Turmoil---Indian
it gives some ideas why I am positive.
Hi Jite
Thanks for your visit. I quite agree with you. Let us hope our rulers will wake up and do the needful.
soumyasrajan-every coins have heads and tails,lets face the problem from the face side 'cause tail won't help us in any way,why the hell should be we looking for some one helping us for our personal problems,we are strong enough to do our own Afghanistan and Iran ,if they can do this much for just one incident,why cant we do it for whatever we are suffering for 20+ years but they would dare not,incompetency my friend,rather impotency.Thanda thanda cool-cool.
Yes of course suny51! It is not just about 20+ years, first attack from Pakistan by using Muslim terrorist type infra-structure built with its army top and rulers was immediately after our independence in 1947, they were then called Mujahiddeen. We have done practically nothing. Their attacks increased considerably of course during last 20+ years after Pakistani army top and feudal rulers got finance and arms from USA, in the name of fighting Afghanistan. Now again they are getting the same in the name of fighting Extremists ( are they fighting ? are they not really the main moving force behind these terrorists? How Americans have been expecting them to fight these forces? Is this not the golden goose they have been using to get finance and arms from USA?). We should expect very soon from these sponsored terrorists even missiles, aeroplanes, nuclear related instruments etc. supplied by USA to these forces or left by it in this war or supplied by proxy for USA like China (there is news that Obama administration will not oppose supplying of Nuclear plans missiles etc. from China to Pakistan and that Obama administration will take help of China to solve problems in South Asia)
Your impression that Americans have handled things after that one incident, I am not so sure how right it is. Where is their handling visible? Right now they are the ones who are financing and arming army top and feudal lords in Pakistan. Practically every day their army and political top leaders visiting Pakistan issue statements like "Pakistan has right to use some form terror machinery like Taliban for its strategic interests against India and Afghanistan". Perhaps such statements are issued out for fear of insecurity of American soldiers in Af-Pak sector. By any means such a style can be called handling? They are fighting war in fact from both sides. I have written more details about it in articles referred above and a recent one
http://hubpages.com/hub/NewsViews-April-2010-Terro
Our Congress government as well as other friends of USA under their pressure also seems to be moving in opposite direction, rather than handling this terror. For example I have never heard Canadians speaking even a word about terror sponsorship from Pakistani top rulers. But they have started calling our army a terrorist/violent organization (obviously this must be under pressure from USA and because of problems they are facing in Pakistan).
http://www.dnaindia.com/india/report_canada-insult
There were similar problems earlier from UK, USA.
So we should be ready not only to handle Pakistani army top and feudal rulers but also problems USA, UK, Canada will create for us because of their inept handling and arming this very top ruling clan of Pakistan. They seem to see very little option time being accept to make statements to please Pakistani rulers and help them. Our ruling party clan led by Congress as usual has nothing but meek response towards all such incidents.
We will not only have to handle situation but handle in our own way. I have suggested above one possible path.
Actually we can not expect much from our ruling parties specially left oriented ones and Congress etc. timebeing. They have been messing up our country with just slogans and very little proper action. Let us hope it changes.
This is a great article. I can see that you are an expert ininternational affairs. Not my strongest area. But it seems to me you have presented very good ideas that make sense. Thank you for the link to this article.
Thanks a lot James! Actually professionally I do research most of the time in very technical subjects Mathematics, Computer Engineering digital electronics etc. Nothing to do international affairs. But I do enjoy equally news, politics, spiritualism reading, thinking, discussing about almost any thing. I think you must be almost same.
It's interesting to see the view from the other perspective, even if I find myself in disagreement with some of the analysis. I will only say that our relationship with Pakistan is a tenuous one, and only for strategic purposes. It's the best way in, and their cooperation, however it had been mustered, was essential—had we not gotten it, they surely would have been targets instead of allies. As it should be from my perspective BTW.
Hi! Springboard
Thanks for your comments. The problem lies in the way USA and also India and others are approaching the problem. I agree with you. I feel target should have been not actually whole of Pakistan but its army top and some ruling feudal lords. Current status is that they are blackmailing India for decades and USA, Europe for almost whole of last decade using terrorist machinery created by them. Until USA was hit it actually helped them to blackmail India occasionally. Now all these countries (India does it only on its soil and not in Afghanistan and Pakistan) are fighting foot-soldiers of this terrorist machinery and western countries with their soldiers fighting it out in Afghanistan and Pakistan without proper planning and involvement have given even more blackmailing tools in the hands of these top rulers. There is no doubt that just now USA needs help from some elements in Pakistan. USA has enough clout to get this help without getting blackmailed. But it prefers to be happily blackmailed and manage affairs in rather shabby manner including getting its own money and arms etc. in the hands of enemy terrorist organizations via this blackmailing . Countries like India are handling much worse than even USA.
One thing has always been clear to me; America will NEVER move a finger unless it has an economic interest (or a stategic one, that later will result in economic benefits). America never cared for anybody else except itself, so forget about principals - you will hear the slogans, but big words like, justice, democracy, freedom and the rest are empty words that come cheap, so don't believe it.
Look back at recent history and get your clues from there; Noriega and Saddam were monsters created by America and so is Taleban,
Saving face? What face? America has lost face a long time ago. Micky Dee is an American born and an ex-marine, but he is also a very intelligent and honest man and sees reality for what it is. If you bet in America's help you lose before you even start difending yourself.
Hi! Petra
Thanks for your visit and comment. I do not find so odd that America will look for its own interest. But point is
now for quite some time its administration seems to be getting it into quagmires, one after another then in the name of searching for face saving devices moving to another disaster.
Even if its administration tries to look after American interests, it might do much better.
Not that administrations of other countries like India or Europe are doing much better.
PETRA v- Saddam and Taliban iron fisted evil eule would have been much worse now than those guys are what was around before Noreiga, Saddam and Taliban would be way worse thse fools are. I don't think anyone "elected" in thoose areas will be any good or fair- they don't understand goodness , being fair or FREEDOM, THAT IS THE usaS MISTAKE THINKING non democratic thugocracies will ever change...iraq has at least got a shot now Afghanistann should be made into a big parking lot for our Indian freinds- or the largest demilitarized zone in the world
Hi! tom
Welcome! I enjoyed your articles very much.
I agree with you people with certain style may become much worse if they are just left. It will be a big mistake to do so.
The main problem how ever I feel much more with rulers who control like army or feudal lords in Pakistan and similar other regimes in some of Muslim countries, than in Afghanistan. It is kind of proxy war being fought with India initially and now with many countries all over world specially in USA and Europe. But administration and policy makers in USA seem to have lost its path. As a result it just now finds it self doing nothing but helping its own enemy- these rulers and is trying to force countries like Israel or India to do all sort of compromises with these very destructive rulers. Not that countries like India are doing any better.
A Vote Up from me for your useful perspective! It sure is easy to end up supporting/helping terrorists with our political moves and not foreseeing the rammifications. We need your thoughts soumyasrajan, so thank you!
Hi! Ms. Dee
Welcome! Thanks a lot for so encouraging comment. I also liked your articles very much.
You ask a good question. It sure is foolish for the U.S. government to fight from both sides and ride the fence like this. Playing both sides is asking for trouble, as history of such tactics has proven. Sad.
Hi! Ms. Dee
Thanks for the visit. Yes! indeed. I wrote this about 6 months back. Now with wikileaks there is very little doubt that American Government is following a policy to finance and arm organizations like Pakistani army top and ISI which seem to be practically controlling terrorist organizations like Taliban and Al-Qaeda. Thus Americans are financing killing of their own soldiers as well as killings and terrorist attacks in India, quite knowingly? It seems to be much worse than what I mentioned. But I find very little questioning of this in American main stream media and press. It looks like they have taken sort of defeatist attitude, "we can not do any thing about it"? Or that Democrat slant is so strong in media and press that it does not want to talk about it.
Very good article and analysis on a complicated subject.
Hi! lisadpreston
Thanks a lot for the visit and nice comment. I wrote this article almost 6 months back. Event after that and wiki-leaks etc. show even more firmly what I was observing then.
sir Pakistan has a very vital role to play in AFghanistan . Remember the episode of mullah bardar or badar he was trying to talk out with America with out Pakistan concent and look what happened he was caught and loaded up AFghan talk can never progress with out Pakistan . that would mean a civil war since pathans have a great population on both sides of the bordar and they are both inter related fata and waziristan is considered a main hole of AFghanistan politics. i am not saying that Pakistan will get the same position as before 9/11 no sir but it also doesn't mean that its to whacked up that it wont find its way there remeber it was pakistan which had the dialogue with taliban before 9/11 not usa it cant hold that much influence agaisnt taliban as Pakistan which is i repeat the long term alley of the pushtoon goverment in AFghanistan
Hi! Abdul
Thanks a lot for your visit and comment. I agree with one implication in your comment that Pathans live on both sides of the boarder and for a long term peace it is needed that that there is an easy path for them to cross the borders.
But I am not sure for that one needs war or Talibans etc. Just as an example look at borders of USA and Canada or borders of countries in European Union. They are practically open borders. In European union one does not need even a visa to cross.
I am not sure that in Pakistan terror or war problem has any thing to do with average Pathan or more generally average people in Pakistan. The problem I describe here and at other places is mainly created by army top and some feudal lords who rule countries like Pakistan Saudi Arabia etc. They have used color of religion and ethnic disputes to hide their support to terrorist network and economic exploitation of the country. Many articles I have referred here from Pakistani writers also analyse the same. Problem is magnified because they could also exploit weaknesses in democratic set up in countries like USA, India etc. Particularly quagmire in which USA finds itself and support it has provided to this top ruling class has been quite responsible for today's unfortunate state of affairs.
well yes i hvae never seen that america or canada ever saying that this is my land that america or cancada is having
durand line has beeen the reason why pakistan backed the taliban in first place go and search the wiki pedia why ISI leader Hamid gul was sacked
till late eighties it was belived that most attackes were done by khad rather then mossad or raw who was the country who first apposed that Pakistan should join the UN . i want u to read the book called
Pakistan and theWar on Terror
CONFLICTED GOALS, COMPROMISED PERFORMANCE
Ashley J. Tellis
or go to the chapter of BOOK "Pakistan beyond the crisis state by maliha lodhi " I also agree with ur assessment but unlike u i am also aware of the back ground better then u simply because i am the man living in PAkistan if u look at the my hub called Islamic political parties u would know that it was not the feudal mainly it was the political parties who were behind this . its the feudal now who are getting the rid of this menace although no matter how dirty they may be be nazir was a feudal yet she was the assassinated why .
Hi! Abdul
Thanks a lot for your comment and information. I will surely go through your article. Thanks for the the same.
H P Roychoudhury 2 years ago
America don't want to create another vietnam. To save the prestiage, America have no alternative but to withdraw its forces keeping Afghanistan in the hands of Pakistan.